yesterday on the 12th day of the bashou a female spectator tried to get on the dojou. 
"No. 9 maegashira Takamisakari, who saved sumo a major embarrassment by stopping a fan before she could get up on the ring Wednesday, claimed his sixth win". it amazed me that they not rebuild the dojou as a women is considered unclean(one of the reasons that they are not allowed on the dojou.
 | I read about this. Why are women considered unclean Dennis? |
 | some things are left to be understood just because it's tradition.... men have theirs, we have ours.... it's just a matter of respecting the traditions of the other.... if traditions like sumo are not respected by all, (i'm not saying we have to believe them, just respect them) then my future children could not behold the sight of a real sumo tournament in the years to come... That would be a shame, wouldn't it.... our children and our children's children not having to enjoy the sights and sounds of countless cultures just because the people before them have abused and neglected them... We should preserve our traditions.... However, we must also take in to consideration which tradition can be harmful to humanity and which are not.... The woman thing in sumo is not really condescending if you ask me... as modern women, we already know better... it's the 21st century... But seppukus or other life-threatening traditions are the ones we should try to eliminate. |
| Yes, I'm asking Dennis if he knows why, cos I don't know the reason behind it. Just asking, so that maybe I would understand it better. I'm not saying it's wrong or that they should scrap the whole thing. I didn't mean to show any disrespect, but if I did then I apologise. Just wanted to know the reason behind it, that is all. |
Comment deleted at the request of the author.
Comment deleted at the request of the author.
| In that case, I apologise to you for my misunderstanding Krizla. I was afraid that I might have offended you unintentionally. I thank you for your understanding. |
| hehehe.... don't worry... it was my fault... so we're cool? ;-) |
 | sorry for the late reply, wel with old repressive ways (and religions) women were considered impure because they shed blood once a month (this would desecrate holy places). while long ago this was considered holy because of fertility (when men took over everything went down the drain.
i do not agree with this, but it is of stupid traditions like this that women were repressed through the ages. |
| i agree,although i like sumo because it's so cool.. it reminds me of Honda from Street Fighter... hehehe, something i used to watch when i was a kid ;-) did you see that hundred hands trick? |
| more info TOKYO (Reuters) - A woman invaded a sumo ring -- a sacred arena from which females are banned -- in Tokyo during a major tournament, domestic media said on Thursday, then was pulled down by a referee and one of the sport's huge wrestlers. The middle-aged woman dashed from the side of the Kokugikan sumo stadium on Wednesday and shoved away a female security guard before rolling onto the ring just as a bout was set to begin, the Yomiuri newspaper said. The Japan Sumo Association insisted that though the woman did enter the raised platform around the batting ring, she did not set foot on the ring, or dohyo, itself. "It's bad for the heart," said Takamisakari, a popular wrestler who helped catch the woman, told the Sports Nippon daily. "What was the person trying to do while we were wrestling seriously?" It was not clear why she had attempted to reach the ring during one of the sport's heavily televised six big tournaments, but she was carrying a bundle of flyers saying "help, bad spirits," Nikkan Sports daily reported. Such an intrusion would be a severe faux pas for the ancient sport, which is so serious about keeping females out that a female governor of Osaka had to delegate prize-giving duties to a male subordinate at a 2001 tournament. Japan's giant wrestlers battle it out in a ring with a diameter of 4.6 meters (15 feet) set in the centre of a sand stage raised around 50 centimeters (19 inches) from the ground. Tradition forbids women from entering the ring on the grounds that it is sacred and their presence, considered unclean, would pollute it. "It's just the way it's been from the past," an official from the sumo association said. Women were also banned in the past from climbing mountains or entering mines in Japan. http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20070920/od_n m/sumo_woman1_dc;_ylt=AswNrSbUWX0bzbrHJy r65cMSH9EA |
 | Muslims also consider women as 'unclean'
that's why Muslim women pray in separately from the men, wear clothings to cover every inch of their skin (even their eyes), etc
some other beliefs also do those things
but, frankly, i'm kinda' surprised about this matter since Japanese praised women respectively in their Shinto religion |
| shinto praises japanese women? well japanese man still expect their wives to be at home while they go out with their colleaugues, to oppai bars and then to his misstress -__- |
| really? is it common for Japanese men to have mistresses? |
| not common, but it happens more than you would expect, even one of the japanese managers i knew proclaimed when you are on business trip anything is allowed. 0__0 |
| not common, but it happens more than you would expect, even one of the japanese managers i knew proclaimed when you are on business trip anything is allowed. 0__0 |
| tsk, tsk tsk... too bad women can't enjoy that kind of freedom... |
| they can what do you think japanese women do when their husband is on business trip ^__^ |
| krizia3182 wrote on Sep 28, '07, edited on Sep 28, '07  they can what do you think japanese women do when their husband is on business trip ^__^  uh, preparing tea? hehe... but good point though.... *sigh* Why can't everybody just practice monogamy?!? ;-) |
| well it is not common, but seems to happen here more than in my country ^__^ |
| I'm replying to Sakura and all that have read her reply.
1. No, Muslims do not consider women unclean. Islam uplifted women and gave them equality and expects them to maintain their status. If mankind changes these facts then the blame is on mankind and not on Islam (the religion).
2. The reason why men and women pray separately is not be distracted. To focus on our prayers. Not because women are unclean.
3. When women have their period they are consider in a "state of impurity". Hence, there are many things that she need not have to do, e.g prayers, fasting etc. But after her period is over, then all is ok. You see her that Islam women don't consider women unclean, they are in a state of impurity. Only that period of time.
4 Muslim women don't have to wear clothings to cover every inch of their skin (even their eyes). Here are the criterias on how to wear the "Hijap" or Islamic dress/veil in English language.
A. The extent of covering obligatory is to cover the complete body except the face and the hands upto the wrist. If they wish to, they can cover even these parts of the body. So not every inch needs to be covered, no need to cover the eyes.
B. The clothes worn should be loose and should not reveal the figure. You don't have to wear a burqa, a pair of jeans and a long sleeve t-shirt will do.
C. The clothes worn should not be transparent such that one can see through
them.
D. The clothes worn should not be so glamorous as to attract the opposite sex.
E. The clothes worn should not resemble that of the opposite sex.
F. The clothes worn should not resemble that of the unbelievers i.e. they
should not wear clothes that are specifically identities or symbols of other religions.
The status of women in Islam is often the target of attacks in the media or papers. Sakura, please do not write such things if you don't know or have limited knowledge on them. It might mislead people to believing what you wrote, like the media and papers. I am sorry if I have offended anyone. It wasn't my intention.
I am not here to argue or debate with anyone. But if someone gives a wrong info about anything (not necessarily about Islam) I think I need to correct it. I am not a scholar or a cleric, I don't know everything, but whatever I know, I will share.
Please do not judge Islam by it's followers, judge Islam by it's teachings.
Thank you. Love, Peace and Joy to all. |
| Yusni, no problem, but why are there a different set of rules for women than for man, than man should also wear some thing like a hijap, and state of impure is nothing less than saying that during that time the woman itself is impure. having seperate rules for man and woman is in itself demeaning (western church has different rules for man and women by the way) |
| Well men and women are equal, but both have difference strength and weaknesses. While as all of us know that men are indeed more stronger than women, but try asking a men to be in labour, I tell you, men will die...Hahaha! Men is not strong enough in that area, but women are. Same thing in pregnancy, I don't think we men are able to carry a child for 9 months. Bringing the baby here and there. Men are not fit enough for this kind of weight. They can pump iron for many years but to be pregnant for for nine months, men will in on medical leave for the whole 9 month.
Having said all these, my point here is while there are similarities about both genders, there are also differences between them. Thus separate rules applies for these differences. other than that, all rules applies to both men and women. For your info, these separate rules are not many, very few and yet it have been the caused of many attacks on Islam.
There are so many rules applies to both genders e.g Prayers, fasting, charity, how to behave, believes, forgiveness, justice, purification, repentance, and many more, all these applies to both men and women. And all these many rules of both genders are not told by the media or wrote in the papers. Media choose only showed and write about that small and few separate rule to the world, that's why the world only know those few separate rule. So how to blame the world? I don't blame them, cause they only read what they have and see what they saw.
People usually only discuss ‘hijab’ (Islamic dress) in the context of women. However, in the
Glorious Qur’an, Allah (swt) first mentions ‘hijab’ for men before ‘hijab’ for the
women. The Qur’an mentions in Surah Noor (Chaper 24) verse 30:
“Say to the believing men that they should lower their gaze and guard their modesty: that will make for greater purity for them: and Allah is well acquainted with all that they do.”
Meaning, the moment a man looks at a woman and if any brazen or unashamed thought
comes to his mind, he should lower his gaze. Should he carry on looking with a naughty thought, then it'll become a fantasy and it could lead to molestation or even rape.
The next verse of Surah Noor, says:
“ And say to the believing women that they should lower their gaze and guard their modesty; that they should not display their beauty and ornaments except what (must ordinarily) appear thereof; that they should draw veils over their bosoms and not display their beauty except to their husbands, their fathers, their husbands’ fathers, their sons...”
So you see, hijab is mention first for men then for women. Knowing that men desires are so much more higher than women, that's is why it's mention first, a reminder first to men, then to women.
Although we many defer in Religion, language or race. We all have to agree that we are all children of God. And by agreeing and following God's commandments, then can we a better place to live in. Whether we Christian, Jews, Muslims, Hindus or Buddhists, black, white, oriental etc, male or female, rich or poor, Dutch, German, Americans, etc that is secondary, the primary fact is that we are all children of God, and we should learn to love each other.
If we only have love for your own race, then we will tend to discriminate, discriminate only generates hate, and hate will lead to anger, and anger will lead to war. |
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